Herb Lore of Madrim and Forum Visibility

[Maina]

Two things!

First: I think one of our abilities, Herb Lore of Madrim, may be incomplete. If it is, and it would help any, I'd be willing to write up the herb descriptions if I were provided with what they did?

Second: Given the super-secretive nature of some of our abilities (like the above), could there be consideration given to making this subforum only for people actually playing Wardens? Is there a reason it's public?

[Ruta]

Is there a reason they're super-secretive? I've still never gotten a straight, official-sounding answer about what this guild is and what its people do. All I've been told is that members like RPing as druids. I'm not sure what even that means. Druidry spells I've seen and used all have to do with plants and animals and nature, but when I think about the very few times I hear people talk about this guild or its members they sound more like fortune tellers and diviners that sound more up the alley of Mummers for this game.

Why are they keeping so many secrets? Why are they hiding druidic information from their fellow druids, like the Udemi? Why are they so exclusive and dodgy when it comes to people interested in learning more about their group or seeking to join? Are they being secret and exclusive just because it's fun to do so? I'm not trying to sound accusatory or mocking here, I've just met with constant frustration trying to get any kind of substantial information about this guild, and in the end I've come to the unfortunate conclusion that they're just that secret club that is secret for the sake of being secret rather than having any actual need to be secretive about anything they know or do.

If you guys all really do have a reason to be ultra secretive and have a hidden board, then more power to you. I'm just always so confused about why you would have a guild that is listed public and that players will seek more info on and possibly to join, yet have virtually no information available on it OOC and have all the members IC pretty much acting averse to letting anyone learn anything about their exclusive secret club. I assume at this point that the wiki link is left broken on purpose, to increase the feeling of exclusivity and secretiveness.

Please don't misunderstand me. I'm already in a guild that I like. I've never wanted to join this group. I just want to understand why it exists and what it's supposed to actually be. If it's really just for a narrow niche of people who like RPing their special way of druidry then that's all well and good, just let people know that that's what this guild listed on the wiki is all about.

[Maina]

This is very off-topic and not at all what this thread was for, but to answer some questions:

Is there a reason they're super-secretive? Yes. Some knowledge needs to be kept out of the wrong hands, and that is part of the Wardens' mission.

Why are they hiding druidic information from their fellow druids? Because 'druid' in this game's lore just means that someone is able to channel a connection to nature, regardless of the word or name you give to nature. Not all druids have the same mission, and Udemi, by lore, use nature as a tool to fight back against the Resen. They do not exist to serve nature and that is not part of their mission statement. They are not druids the way most people think of druids, even if they are druids according to the lore definition.

Why are we hard to join? Because there are not many of us active. I may be the only one, presently, and I wasn't active until recently. Even when we are active, we are very selective because the Wardens are an RP-heavy guild. The joining process involves weeks to months of regular RP to ensure the new character can fulfill the role and duties required and won't just quit as soon as they see all the secrets. Same as other invite-only guilds. It is also a guild not built around being "powerful" in combat but in fulfilling a very specific role.

As to what the guild even is, I will copy Tangela's post from another thread in this forum:

Sure! So the basic idea of this guild is that they are druids. They are interested primarily in the Gaea, protecting it, communing with it, and, when possible, helping others to be in alignment with it. They are spiritualists, teachers, and ritualists, interested in the spiritual and physical relationship with the land, and with Atros, the goddess who represents the Gaea, and Madrim, the green man and cultivator of herbs. RP often consists of rituals performed to strengthen your connection with the gaea, as well as using the guild abilities, which I can't discuss at any length, but they are in line with these general principles. For inspiration of possible rituals, you might look at
http://www.paganlibrary.com/rituals_spells/index.php
As for the name, it refers to the fact that they are supposed to have been in hiding, and possess secrets, or lore, related to the Gaea not known to other Gaea-using groups like the Udemi, though they work closely together.

[Ruta]

That's the same quote that was given to me the last time I asked, which tells me that members like to RP in a certain way, but doesn't tell me anything about any purposes or niches or roles the guild itself might serve as part of a game. In other words, why wouldn't I just RP one of these druids without a guild, or while part of another guild? Assassins, Thieves, and Harbingers are all cagey about their doings and don't have specific abilities listed on their OOC wiki pages, but there's still some information available to players about what kind of game experience players can expect when their characters are a part of these guilds, and not just their flavor of RP. What reason is there to join the Wardens of the Grove beyond RP, or is it really just solely for RP? It sounds like from your other answers that joining the guild may truly just be for specific RPers. RP and a spell that tells you things about herbs, which does sound cool, but also brings me back to the reason why I replied in this thread to a request in the original post:

What about this guild warrants forum invisibility and such secrecy even on an OOC level? It all seems to point to there being so much more to this guild that people could absolutely love and dive into if they knew more, but it's withheld from the playerbase because reasons.

[Maina]

The reason to join is for the RP. If the RP isn't enough for you, then you can join another guild. That is part of the reason for the lengthy selection process. Abilities and mechanics are there to support Warden RP, one is not inducted for the mechanics. Their niche and role is precisely what has been told to you before: to act as spiritualists, teachers, and ritualists. To protect, commune with, and educate about the Gaea. If you want to roleplay that sort of character, that is what the Wardens are for. If you don't, join another guild. If you want to play one of that sort of character and join another guild, feel free to do so, but you will not have the mechanical and in-character support for that role that Wardens have. Much like how you can play an assassin without being a member of the Claws of Shar, but it certainly helps.

This is not the only guild that operates this way. Snowpine is much the same. You can play a hiker and explorer in other guilds, but you join Snowpine for Snowpine RP. It doesn't come with secrets that would devalue the guild if the playerbase at large knew them, though, so it isn't invite-only.

Every invite-only guild has secrets that would devalue membership if they were known at large, so every invite-only guild has very restricted public information. Of them, Wardens also have the lowest population (to my knowledge, of the ones that are still possible to join) and is (as you've been told before) going through some changes. So there's even less information.

[Ruta]

All right. I'd be satisfied with it being made crystal clear it's a guild solely for the RP. Except:

If you want to play one of that sort of character and join another guild, feel free to do so, but you will not have the mechanical and in-character support for that role that Wardens have.

Which you will not tell us anything about!

Snowpine Lodge, all the invite-only guilds, the guilds with hidden abilities: They all have at least a basic wiki page that says "This is what the guild is about, and this is the general kind of playstyle members can expect to be most supported in." Wardens continue to insist on being extremely tight-lipped about the second part, and the more I see their responses, the more I think either 1) There's actually no big secrets and they're just enjoying being regarded as secret-keepers by outsiders, or 2) They have secret abilities that they're worried about other players - not characters IC, but players OOC - knowing that they have. Thieves, Assassins, Harbingers all hide their abilities because it gives them an edge against their prey (frequently other player characters). So, this could be taking an interestingly sinister turn.

Anyway. I'll request a wiki account and see if I can at least give you all a wiki article that has what scarce information you've been willing to share about your guild. I feel like players deserve at least that.

[Maina]

You have been given the answer to that part multiple times. You apparently just don't like the answer for some reason. The answer isn't going to change by asking it repeatedly, and this remains very off-topic for this thread. The playstyle is being a druid (in the historical or fantasy sense, not CLOK's "anyone who can use druidry" sense), a spiritualist, a ritualist, a caretaker for the Gaea, a priest/priestess of nature, etc.

You've apparently made up your mind and refuse to listen to the answer being given you. I am done derailing my own thread to repeat myself endlessly.

[Ruta]

You have been given the answer to that part multiple times. You apparently just don't like the answer for some reason. The answer isn't going to change by asking it repeatedly, and this remains very off-topic for this thread. The playstyle is being a druid (in the historical or fantasy sense, not CLOK's "anyone who can use druidry" sense), a spiritualist, a ritualist, a caretaker for the Gaea, a priest/priestess of nature, etc.

You're repeatedly telling me about the roleplay angle for this guild. It tells me nothing about any kind of meta playstyle in the context of the game's mechanics, abilities, tasks, capability in combat or lack thereof, capability in healing or lack thereof, capability in crafting or lack thereof.

I get that this is a guild for hardcore RPers, many of which may not be so concerned with these meta things, but that doesn't change the fact that they're there and that interested players deserve to at least be given a basic grasp of what styles of mechanical support or options they'll have available to them. The fact that Wardens are refusing to talk about their meta game mechanical capabilities and even requesting their forum be hidden so that they can feel free to discuss them behind closed doors just emphasises that this is in fact a matter of importance to Wardens.

You asked for the guild forum to be hidden because of this, and I am asking why. This discussion is on-topic based on the original post.