General Roleplay Thread

[Rithiel]

I think everybody is aware (or they should be) that we here at CLOK take our RP very seriously. But we don't often talk about how to RP. We all come from a variety of different gaming backgrounds, and for some this idea of keeping IC and OOC things separate may be difficult.

So let's talk about what works and doesn't, things that annoy you (as a character or a player), and fun things you may discover. Veterans can give tips or suggestions, staff can talk about things we see that we don't like (or do!), and maybe somebody will learn something. Every once in a while I'll even throw out some of the lesser-known RP verbs that are out there. You can only RP as well as the person that you're interacting with, right?

[Jaren]

One thing that irks me sometimes is when people confuse my RP character with my real life persona. As many of you may or may not know, my character is super evil. He is just not "mwa hahahaha I'm evil for no reason" but he actually has a long past which has made him the person he is today. As such, many forget that "my character" will often do things that "me" as a real life person would never do.

I don't use this as an excuse to randomly gank or harass people but if I attack you or act rude it should not be taken personally. Just go along with it and play along. Sometimes it can be more fun to lose in an RP situation than to "always win". A good evil RPer knows that he is to act as an antagonist to the story and he/she may be on the losing side. Anyways, please don't confuse what I do in character with who I am as a person. If you ever have any concerns, please send me an OOC tell.

[Rithiel]

You may or may not know that a lot of RP verbs have different messaging when self-targeted.

For example:
bounce - You bounce about happily.
bounce rithiel - You bounce on the balls of your feet, ready for action.

In the middle of a group is probably not the best place to try to discover these, but when you find yourself with some alone time (and you're actually alone, not in the middle of an NPC crowd, which I'll talk about later), it might be useful to explore your self-targeted options so you're ready when the opportunity to use them arises.

[Bryce]

Sometimes it can be more fun to lose in an RP situation than to "always win".

I have been highly annoyed several times now when I, for instance, groinkick someone, and they emote completely ignoring it. Wait, what? I just kicked you in the testicles. The messaging stated you fell to the ground, stunned, groaning in pain. Yet the next thing you do is to stand up and emote that you calmly go about your business, specifying that you ignore the assault that just occured on your nutsac and the resulting nausea? Come on, man. It's like the person got nailed mechanically, but they don't like to think of "their character" as being fallible, so they just emote ignoring it and sort of handwave it away. Tacky.

Don't get me wrong, it's one thing to try and save face. My character tries to all the time, he doesn't want to show that anyone ever one-ups him. At the same time, when someone DOES get him, I try to at least grudgingly acknowledge that, at the very least with a swear or a grumble or a moody stomping-off or whatever. I don't just try to go "Nope! Didn't really happen, didn't affect me." It's okay to not "win" all the time, even with little RP situations that aren't battles to the death. My character flinches or glances around nervously when Lae picks up a frying pan or rolling pin and glances his way, even though mechanically she has very little chance of actually hitting him with it. He would glare and glower in grudging defeat when Beniah brought his superior strength and physique into some kind of conflict he and my character were having. Stuff like that. It's okay to admit defeat sometimes, or that someone "got you". It's nice to be foiled now and then, and to even have a character that is frequently your foil and both keeps you in check and gives you someone to strive to triumph over eventually. Or whatever. Overall moral of the story: Don't get it in your head that you're going to RP your character as somoene who never loses or never gets caught flat-footed or whatever. It's unrealistic and unbelievable.

Heck, I'll use Kent as a good example here. I think just about everyone knows he and River don't get along at all. Kent was driving River nuts one night (surprised?), and she hit him with a cold spell that made him fall asleep. Kent was a good sport and rolled with it. When his character woke up, he roleplayed being cold and confused and not knowing what just happened, or anything that had happened while he was asleep, despite his player having been able to see everything that was going on. His character is a tough as nails Coalition mercenary! But he got got, and he accepted that and rolled with it. Kudos, Kent.

On the same note, I feel the same about when people smile and joke and whatever after having just taken serious wounds and stuff, like you take 125 damage to your leg and fall over, but you don't want to show that your opponent just "got you" so what do you do? Laugh and stand up, maybe sneer for good measure, as if having your leg nearly taken off by a handaxe didn't bother you at all. Come on man, that's crap. That's your player acting, not your character. I'm not saying you have to emote screaming in pain or anything like that, just don't specifcally act to show that a traumatic or severely painful experience didn't phase you. I don't buy the "My character gets wounded every day, he's immune to it by now" excuse either. I call BS, barring some kind of special ability or power that numbs pain, and even then I don't buy completely shrugging it off like nothing just happened. Because look, I can still stun you with a kidneyshot or a footstomp. What causes that debilitating stun? Pain.

On to something more positive, I'll say I'm impressed with people that make good use of the different speeches and tones. It always makes the interactions more rich and have more feeling. I wish I remembered to use them more often, that's something I want to improve at.

Some people use very expressive emotes via the EMOTE command. Props to these people too, it always enriches the roleplaying experience. Something else I want to be better at. The people I've seen doing this are always good about not using emotes to make other people do something or feel something, or anything like that. In a certain other game there were some people would do things like: "Bob sneers and puts out his foot, tripping Bryce and causing Bryce to fall to the ground and feel like a fool." Yuck. Not only did he force an action on my character (falling to the ground), but a feeling as well (feel like a fool) and somehow everyone else in the room knew how my character was feeling. Haven't seen anything like that in CLOK so far, I think, so kudos to all our awesome emoters.

Edits: spelling errors.

[Slaidh]

Like Jaren said. My character can be mean and rude, rough around the edges at the very least. That's just my character though. I as a player don't actually think anyone is stupid, or a pansy, or a coward, or stuff like my character says. I think I'm a pretty nice guy in real life so please don't take it personal! But by all means let your character take it personal, Slaidh would enjoy a good fight!

[Lysse]

I know I've been on an extended break of sorts, but it's a pet peeve of mine when people don't acknowledge the existence of regular NPCs and virtual NPCs as valid people. As in, treating a city street as completely deserted when it probably isn't, just people that stand out (like guards) aren't around. And not taking things like attacks on NPCs as seriously as an attack on a PC.

I have a lot of respect for people that include little quirks into their characters. Things like little fears, ambitions, and ticks. They help to round out a character, and helps the game feel a little more real, and less two dimensional.

[Rithiel]

I know I've been on an extended break of sorts, but it's a pet peeve of mine when people don't acknowledge the existence of regular NPCs and virtual NPCs as valid people. As in, treating a city street as completely deserted when it probably isn't, just people that stand out (like guards) aren't around. And not taking things like attacks on NPCs as seriously as an attack on a PC.

I was going to mention this later, but I'll do it now.

Characters have gotten into trouble thinking that rooms are empty because there aren't any PCs in it and doing things that they assume nobody sees. NPCs are people, too, whether they are actual entities in the game or simply a crowd in a room. If you have a conversation in the middle of the market, there's a good chance that somebody could have heard it and told somebody else, and that there may be consequences to that. We're always on the look out for ways to throw wrenches at characters, and a lot of them have come about because people do things around NPCs thinking they won't notice.

A similar, but somewhat reversed idea, is that PCs are not the only people in CLOK. Roads between busy towns would be, you know, busy. You don't have to greet every single PC you see on the road, because it wouldn't be all that astounding. Yes, be friendly toward other players if that's how you want to be, but don't do it because your character is amazed to find somebody else on the road. Now, if you're in the middle of the forest where you'd expect to be alone, that's a different story.

[Skjotur]

I have nothing but compliments. Everyone I've met has been really cool. Some characters have gimmicks like accents or odd speech patterns or a particular style of dress. Some use cool emotes. It seems like just about everyone has at least some character depth and it's really cool to find out more about them when an opportunity comes up. Even the conflict is always fun which is saying something. It seems like there is always some kind of intrigue or drama going down in CLOK. It's fun to pick up on the gossip.

I like finding places where people camp out in the wilderness. I don't know why. There's just something cool about finding a campsite and seeing a firepit and a cart full of supplies. I guess I just like it because it makes me know there are other wilderness wanderers like myself out there. It's the best when you show up and someone is already there to actually sit and talk to for a while before going on your way. Sometimes we exchange things like food supplies for firestones or whatever before we leave. A kind of camaraderie I guess.

[Lun]

A-ha, I must have committed at least half of these pet peeves, so I'm still learning. I think almost everyone is amazing at playing their characters, and only rarely do I see anyone breaking the fourth wall (aside from new players.)
I should warn people, then, it's not a good idea to perform OOC actions IC. I mean, heck, you might really want to eat that infested squirrel meat as a player but I'm sure your character doesn't.

My biggest pet peeve is when the person I'm talking to inexplicably stops responding in the middle of a conversation for 10 minutes, no OOC response or anything. While I know real life is always around the corner, my character is stuck with someone who just completely zoned out in the middle of a (possibly important) conversation. Sometimes I let it slide and act like no time has passed, but... I had to stand there for 10 minutes, you know.

Another tip is to avoid treating OOC actions as IC things. Some people seem to think that logging out and back in makes their character flicker, but your character is a person in another world. You leaving just basically means that the player isn't there, but we can all pretend in good faith that the character never budged. Or ran home.

[Rithiel]

Do you pick your skills according to RP?

It's always bugged me when I see characters who try to be the master of a bunch of different things. Most often I see this with the professions. I'm not trying to say that you shouldn't learn blacksmithing, mining, leatherworking, farming, and logging - this is a personal thing because when I see that I always want to say, "But what about specialization? Isn't that what Adam Smith said leads to the wealth of nation?!" So I'm curious what other people think about this. I know that the traders (and mercenaries - I think I'm sensing a theme) are built to practice lots of different skills, so I'm curious what some people who play those guilds think.

[xavier]

personally, for me, i prefer specialisation, but i have played characters in different places who were the "jack of all trades" in which I brough their skills up to a level where the char was competent but not masterful. I haven't chosen to make that particular type of character here though, yet, though i'm nuts when it comes to choosing the specialisationi want for which character and thus i'll have a few points in a lot of different stuff cause it's a thinking helper when i'm doing something that doesn't require a lot of attention when i'm thinking about it. I think even if I were to make a trader I'd still specialise, but then I'd specialise in something that was needed and would fill a spot in the environment that didn't already have a wealth of players.

[Orris]

I have always tried to restrict my skills to what's in character for him, and I like having things I can consider myself specialized in and other things that I prevent myself from learning. As an elemancer some of that is forced, but for example, I play Orris as very tied to the sea. Of course I mastered hydromancy. Hydro isn't very powerful in combat, comparitively to Geo or Pyro. I could easily take one of those elements, or just take one in pyro to combine with hydro for steam, a little extra damage. That would just be so out of character though! Why would a Parren seaman who serves Nereia the Sea Goddess be channeling fire? I'm no saying that would be a terrible choice, the university teaches it after all, but it would just feel wrong for my character.

Same for, say, riding. I did eventually buy a horse, but I'm a Parren, a seaman. I'm comfortable on ships, not horses. I doubt there is a lot of horse riding in Parr. Therefore my character very rarely rides his horse, he would rather walk. Plus, horses can't swim, and I'd hate to leave it behind.

On the subject of swimming, that is something that I am kind of concerned about. I'm glad I got it really high before they changed it, Orris is a sailor and a beach bum, swimming is a huge part of his life, so I like that he is really good at it. But I know as soon as more swimming places are added that people will be able to practice more and nobody wants to be prevented from getting somewhere, plus swimming is easy to practice, just swim back and forth forever where it is a challenge, and so soon everyone will be as good at it as me. I know this is selfish bit it's going to be a bummer when I see like warriors and sorceres and stuff who can swim just as well as someone who's been living on the sea for the majority of his life, just because they practiced a few hours and want to be able to go anywhere. That is one thing I liked about the systems in D&D and GS4. You had to sacrifice other areas to get good at something, and it was always a good feeling to have those moments when all the combat optimizers who ignored things like swim, search, and climb had to miss out now and again because of that. Needless to say my characters are never great fighters, I like focusing on the less used skills according to my character's RP. It's not too big a deal though, I appreciate that inCLOK you can do whatever you want. End mini rant, sorry about that!

[Rithiel]

On the subject of swimming, that is something that I am kind of concerned about. I'm glad I got it really high before they changed it, Orris is a sailor and a beach bum, swimming is a huge part of his life, so I like that he is really good at it. But I know as soon as more swimming places are added that people will be able to practice more and nobody wants to be prevented from getting somewhere, plus swimming is easy to practice, just swim back and forth forever where it is a challenge, and so soon everyone will be as good at it as me. I know this is selfish bit it's going to be a bummer when I see like warriors and sorceres and stuff who can swim just as well as someone who's been living on the sea for the majority of his life, just because they practiced a few hours and want to be able to go anywhere. That is one thing I liked about the systems in D&D and GS4. You had to sacrifice other areas to get good at something, and it was always a good feeling to have those moments when all the combat optimizers who ignored things like swim, search, and climb had to miss out now and again because of that. Needless to say my characters are never great fighters, I like focusing on the less used skills according to my character's RP. It's not too big a deal though, I appreciate that inCLOK you can do whatever you want. End mini rant, sorry about that!

This is actually a problem I run into a lot. I love that we have a learn-by-doing skill system, but it irks me when people who wear full-plate practice stealth, or why people who would have no reason to train perception (other than meta-gaming and not wanting to be ambushed) grind it (I have feels for my stealth and perception using guilds). Hence why I brought this up.

I don't know that there's a solution, but I think it is something we should be discussing.

[Rithiel]

We all play a game that relies on typing, so typos are an inevitable part of the gaming experience. How do you deal with typos IC?

Personally, I either ignore them or send the person I'm interacting with a tell to make sure they knew what I was trying to say (when I cause them). When I see them, I read the intent, not the typo. In my mind, correcting them through IC means (either speech or ESP since that's where the majority of typing is done) is worse than the typo. But maybe I'm in the minority?

[Lysse]

If I make a typo I usually just pass it off as misspeaking, unless it's too large of a typo to do so. Then I'll use chat or tells to amend the typo.

If someone makes a typo, I don't point them out. If a person doesn't correct themselves and I can't guess the meaning of the word, I might ask IC for the to repeat themselves, or I'll send a tell asking them what they meant.

[faylen]

On typoes, I admit I generally have corrected them, because my own typoes annoy me. Other people though, I just ignore the typoes unless, like Lysse said, I can't figure out what they were trying to say.

As for skills, with my monk I'm definitely trying to base skills on rp. She's grinded herbalism and first aid, and now of course her monk specific skills are a priority. She'll also learn cooking and leatherworking because she figures those are ways she can help others as well as herself. but I don't see her learning many other profession skills unless some rp reason comes up that changes her mind. She sees no reason to learn to be sneaky, for example, although she's gotten a little of that from hunting animals which she will do for meat and pelts.

Faylen, on the other hand, is all over the place. One of her main things is making her own arrows, and the recent changes have forced her into learning to forge because she doesn't like having to depend on others who may or may not come through to provide arrowheads, and she wants them as sharp as possible. She's dabbled in leatherworking too so to be able to make her own armor, but almost all of what she's done save a few experiments in the beginning surrounds her desire to fight the infested.

I think having a smaller playerbase contributes to some of this. Too much specialization leaves gaping holes in other areas and so people try to fill every hole.

As far as rp dislikes and likes, one of my favorite things in rp is good use of emoting. In fact, I so rarely use the built in emotes beyond the basics just out of habit, instead I emote how my character is acting, how she sounds, her facial expressions sometimes, all sorts of things. If I see another charcter doing that within reason, I love it because it gives me a better feel for the character I'm telling the story with.

My only real pet peave is this. Don't tell me out of character what your character is thinking or planning, and then expect me to somehow react to that IC. I might chuckle oocly and be amused or find it interesting, but my character still has no idea unless she already did and will act accordingly. Any other peaves are ones I think most would have, like the above mentioned emoting what my character thinks/does about what you just emoted. Just, no. Thankfully, I haven't seen that here either.

I do admit to sometimes forgetting npcs could be around or even likely would be... Not intentionally, but I'm trying to be more mindful of that.

Ok, enough from me.

[Kiyaani]

A pet peeve of mine is using ESP for everyday business or just general conversation. This is a telepathic network used by everybody - PC and NPC alike, not a private channel for the 10+ people currently online. Would you really shout your personal business from the mountaintops for all to hear or would you just use it to request a private meeting to discuss things? I'm pretty sure it would be the latter.

So if you want to buy something, have something crafted, discuss the fancy soles of your shoes, start a hunting expedition, discuss your finances or the state of your farm, whatever it is - do it in private or if you want to gossip, buy a colored pendant from the mummers and have at it. Don't discuss the details over the public network. It's just silly and I'm so tempted to ridicule people for being so open with hundreds or thousands of citizens of the nearby area sometimes. I'm sure Suzy NPC in Mistral and Joe-Bob NPC in Shadgard would appreciate a bit more discretion also because they don't care. They have lives to lead.

[Nootau]

If they don't wish to listen to other's idle thoughts, why do they wear a pendent? I thought the purpose of ESP was to talk about: things to buy, have something crafted, start a hunting expedition, etc...

[Stranger]

In the early days of the telephone many places had what was known as a "Party line" and these systems serviced multiple households who had to wait for one household to finish before they themselves could make a call. It was also an easy way to eavesdrop on your neighbors because you could pick up the line and listen in on their conversations. I see the esp network as being much like this. Even though your call me be directed to one person, MANY others may be listening in.

I imagine the scope of this "party line" encompasses the 3 towns but not everyone is wearing a pendant and actively eavesdropping on the esp network. Also I would imagine that as you got further out, you might have to switch to other esp networks, perhaps there is a set range for the gray network?

Personally my character hates the esp network and only uses it when he has to. However, he endures the relentless prattling so that if something of interest is said, he will be able to act upon it.

[Drayla]

I have to agree with the two posts above me. If the ESP network isn't for general conversation, buying things, selling things, asking for something to be crafted, etc., what is it for? I agree that certain details of business transactions should be discussed in private, but even if they are not, soon enough those people who discuss their business publicly will get consequences. Personally, I believe the ESP network is much too quiet, especially since all these thousands of NPCs are also listening in. I think it would be rather neat to have random NPCs ask for some service over the ESP network that would be similar to a guild task, though the reward would go to the person who provided the service. It would fall upon the PCs, of course, to RP who gets the task, since everyone dropping what they're doing and racing to provide an NPC with something isn't very good RP unless your character already does so for other PCs.

[Kiyaani]

We're discussing RP pet peeves here, not debating them. It's a pet peeve of mine, not something that's a hard rule or that people are doing wrong.

That said, the reason I don't remove the pendant is on the off-chance something relevant actually comes up - much as Stranger said. I don't mean you can't use the pendant for everyday stuff. How could I stop you anyway? But I don't need to hear your price haggling or how poor you are or if your weeds are particularly dreadful today. Personal laments seem like something to use 'think' for, and business transactions can be discussed and finalized via private discussion or mail.

All that stuff in my second paragraph is fine to start up over the pendant, which I tried to make clear in my first, but it bothers me when people go into elaborate detail, discussion or debate for all to hear when only those strictly involved need to know.

As for the consequences you speak of, I'm pretty sure that all the thefts lately are a key reminder that sometimes your business should be kept private. People give out locations of their farms, wagons etc. asking for help and others *are* listening. Perhaps meeting somewhere neutral and escorting them would be better. That's just one example.

[Lemuel]

Something inside of me thinks that most NPC's would do their ESPing on their town network crystal color, eg, Amber for Shadgard, etc. Just musing here.

[TwistedAkai]

Since it looks like the ESP thing might be turning into it's own discussion, I made this thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=3116

[Drayla]

Okay, back to the real topic of this thread, I hate how many characters go around eating nothing but rations all the time as if they tasted like mana from heaven or something. I admit, I've been guilty of this before, but with all of my characters I now stop buying rations once I get a steady source of riln and at least buy baked goods from the bakery until I can learn to cook my own foods. I just have a hard time believing that anyone would eat nothing but something that tastes stale, dry, and lacking in any sort of flavor for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

[Rias]

I hate how many characters go around eating nothing but rations all the time as if they tasted like mana from heaven or something. ... I just have a hard time believing that anyone would eat nothing but something that tastes stale, dry, and lacking in any sort of flavor for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

That reminds me, I've wanted to have some kind of minor morale system, where eating boring/yucky/tasteless food constantly would lower your morale a little, and have some [very minor] negative effects. On the plus side, well-cooked food and more expensive meals from the nicer food establishments could raise morale to grant some [very minor] positive effects. Of course, my ideal vision is people paying good cooks for especially nice food, but I know in reality it will just result in everyone cloistering themselves away for a few hours gathering meat and cooking it enough to get to the point where they can make their own quality foods instead of going to another character who is already an established cook (who makes sense to be such).

Meet Krongarr, Mighty Barbaric Frothing-At-The-Mouth Dwaedn Wyr!! ... and master of the culinary arts with a sophisticated palette.

Anyway, just thinking out loud. Carry on. If you have thoughts on the above "morale system" idea, please start a new topic instead of derailing this one. And by the way, this was totally on-topic. I put a pet peeve in there - characters working away at and mastering skills that just seem silly for their character, just because they want to be able to do everything themselves and/or just can't live without some minor bonus.