Requirement to blacksmith repair is now too much

[Kent]

At the beginning of the Generalized Abilities rollout, it was possible to repair items on the anvil with no blacksmithing abilities chosen at all. I was one of the first players to draw the GM's attention to this (I think it was to Vinz) and soon after, it was changed so that you need General Blacksmithing ability to repair.

More recently, another condition was added to this, now, not only do you need General, you need a specific blacksmithing ability to repair that type of weapon, for example, I can no longer repair my pickaxe because I don't have the forging: Heavy Heads ability.

I would like to state that I think this added requirement has gone too far to be fair or reasonable. It's one thing to forge a pickaxe or a sword completely from scratch, and quite another to repair a fully formed item of the same. In fact, it may be a bit harder to make nails or horseshoes from scratch than to repair an existing weapon or armor.

I would like to request that things be put back the way they were so that only general forging be required to repair.

[jilliana]

+1 to this.

I like being able to repair my own items. I don't feel like it's all that good to waste at least two ability points just for something I repair and not form from scratch.

[merin]

I see both sides of this. On one hand, someone learning to forge anything or commodities will be able to, surely, smooth out dents, cracks, and other such oddities. On the otherhand, a bladesmith will probably be able to smooth those dents and cracks better due to their time and focus ins aid area. I propose that it be lifted, however, if the required ability to repair is not within the player's chosen list of abilities that the durability loss on an item will be doubled or tripled. My argument for that is, although you might know how to repair it, you don't know the intricasies of the weapon or item to avoid "oopses." For example, repairing a blade, you might make it less sharp completely by accident.

[Carressa]

I see both sides of this. On one hand, someone learning to forge anything or commodities will be able to, surely, smooth out dents, cracks, and other such oddities. On the otherhand, a bladesmith will probably be able to smooth those dents and cracks better due to their time and focus ins aid area. I propose that it be lifted, however, if the required ability to repair is not within the player's chosen list of abilities that the durability loss on an item will be doubled or tripled. My argument for that is, although you might know how to repair it, you don't know the intricasies of the weapon or item to avoid "oopses." For example, repairing a blade, you might make it less sharp completely by accident.

I think I'm in love with this idea :)

I was going to comment that by realistic terms, historically the person that would be fighting with a sword would work with a smith, not be one... (excluding a few rare cases) but that for playability the game might look the other way towards this nod to realisim...

But then comes Merin and the idea of "you can fix it but not as well as a dedicated smith can" and I think it sounds pretty awesome!

+1 merin! :)

[Sneaky]

If you're that uptight about your ability points, then you can do yourself a favor and drop both of those abilities and take your weapons and armor to an artasen. Otherwise I'd say go ahead and spend the point. Those who base their characters around these sorts of activities already have.

[Rias]

If you're that uptight about your ability points, then you can do yourself a favor and drop both of those abilities and take your weapons and armor to an artasen. Otherwise I'd say go ahead and spend the point. Those who base their characters around these sorts of activities already have.

"Rias Notdevski thumbs-upped this post."

[Jirato]

At the beginning of the Generalized Abilities rollout, it was possible to repair items on the anvil with no blacksmithing abilities chosen at all. I was one of the first players to draw the GM's attention to this (I think it was to Vinz) and soon after, it was changed so that you need General Blacksmithing ability to repair.

More recently, another condition was added to this, now, not only do you need General, you need a specific blacksmithing ability to repair that type of weapon, for example, I can no longer repair my pickaxe because I don't have the forging: Heavy Heads ability.

This isn't entirely accurate. We were made aware of the oversight/exploit of being able to repair without an ability, but had not done anything about it right away. The change that added in all the additional requirements you mentioned WAS the fix. Up until that change happened, anyone could repair anything, regardless of ability. There was never a time where you needed General Blacksmithing to repair things and could repair anything with General Blacksmithing laone.

[Jinnean]

I would be in favor of the idea to allow 'cobble together' repairs with general blacksmithing and then have proper repairs with the specific blacksmithing abilities. This seems reasonable as a person familiar with a given weapon would be aware of its weaknesses enough to patch the weapon up, possibly the same with armor. That would seem balanced to me. Just my two yen.

[Jirato]

I would be in favor of the idea to allow 'cobble together' repairs with general blacksmithing and then have proper repairs with the specific blacksmithing abilities. This seems reasonable as a person familiar with a given weapon would be aware of its weaknesses enough to patch the weapon up, possibly the same with armor. That would seem balanced to me. Just my two yen.

I'd really only be fine with that if it also had a chance to permanently and severely decrease the quality of the weapon. You don't really take a masterwork crafted by a renowned smith, one of their finest works, and just "cobble something together" to repair it.

[Jinnean]

So then general blacksmith could patch up an item, equal to wrapping some tape around a cable to keep it secure. The specialist can repair items properly, and then an ability that would allow a specialist to undo the damage done by the unskilled patcher?

[vidor]

I really fail to see the problem. Sure it would be great to repair all our own items, but lets face it. I could go get a sword from Ardor for maybe 2000 riln (don't have his prices in front of me). Then, if I can repair that, then I'm looking at 2,000 riln for my combat needs for the rest of forever. It's a nice to have, but by no means a necessity. The people who have equipment needing repairs almost absolutely have the riln to get it done -- riln which will go to artisans (both established and new) who then have an opportunity to be part of clok's combat side, at least tangentially. I've seen people charge fifty to a hundred riln for repairs. If you don't have that much riln, go out and get it. It takes maybe twenty minutes. Much less time than pumping up blacksmithing skill.

[Jinnean]

My thought on this isn't the cost of repairs, or even the ability for everyone to be able to repair. Imagine that a couple of new players show up, wanting to be artisans. They take up mining and forging under the impression that it's profitable and that everyone will buy their stuff. But because everyone can learn everything, they aren't as skilled at anyone else in any particular skill. So nobody asks them for weapons or armor. I'm generally in favor of limitation for any given character so that everyone can contribute meaningfully to the game. Sorry if that doesn't sit well with the majority.

[Kent]

To repair your own item is going to cost 25 riln each time for a workyard fee, not free for life.

I have no problem with getting an artisan to do it...except for the fact I cannot regularly locate an available artisan I know well enough to entrust my rare item with.

[Fog]

I really fail to see the problem. Sure it would be great to repair all our own items, but lets face it. I could go get a sword from Ardor for maybe 2000 riln (don't have his prices in front of me). Then, if I can repair that, then I'm looking at 2,000 riln for my combat needs for the rest of forever. It's a nice to have, but by no means a necessity. The people who have equipment needing repairs almost absolutely have the riln to get it done -- riln which will go to artisans (both established and new) who then have an opportunity to be part of clok's combat side, at least tangentially. I've seen people charge fifty to a hundred riln for repairs. If you don't have that much riln, go out and get it. It takes maybe twenty minutes. Much less time than pumping up blacksmithing skill.

I've only just begun socializing and really meeting new people, so please take what I have to say with a grain of salt.

So far, it hasn't been as easy as "finding an Artisan" to repair things. Maybe that's because I haven't met a lot of people on the game, or because I'm still new, but whenever one of my items has been destroyed through usage, I visit a pawn shop to buy something else that fits similarly in the slot. Based off of a discussion regarding some pricey weaponry yesterday, I know this isn't going to be practical forever, but if you don't play when other players are around that can repair or craft valuable items, it can kind of suck. There's also the learning curve and just general information that can be a lot to take in with a new game.

Something else to think over is that not everyone plays during prime time with other players, and then they have to be capable of helping you, and also have the desire to do so. There are a lot of steps that have been glossed over by simply saying "find an Artisan."

[Noctere]

If you find that an artisan is not available during your regular play hours then perhaps you could ask around on ESP for a reference and use the in game mail system to ask if they would do the repairs for you? Once you have established a trusted artisan it is an easy task to mail the items and riln to them and simply wait till they mail them back to you, all shiny and repaired.

[preiman]

also keep in mind, if a player can't or won't be found to do it, wich is getting rarer and rarer actually yay, then you can always use the NPC shops that offer item repairs. Yeah it takes a while, but cheaper then buying a new weapon every time, though it does mean you'll likely need two of your equipment set, one to wear/use while the other is being worked on.

[Rias]

To be fair, you don't need an Artisan specifically to repair stuff. You just need anyone who has chosen to specialize and invest in the openly-available crafting abilities required for the repairs or, as Preiman mentioned, if no PCs are available to do it, you can take it to an NPC to be repaired.

[merin]

I think my reply got lost in the interwebs!

I was attempting to get across the suggestion Jirato menchened. Having a really good chance of seriously screwing up a weapon bigtime if you're just cobbling something together. ON that note, I think weapons should break as they are, anyway, provided not proper care is given.

On the second part of that, Noctere is absolutely right. ask for a reputable artisan and send them a letter or your weapon and a letter saying man fix this plz. Either they'll do it and mail it back as soon as they can, or, they'll direct you and your business to someone that can (I, personally, will. I can't speak for the rest of them). There's a neat little option that toggles, allowing for you to get an email when your character gets mail. I have this toggled on, so, if I'm alt hopping I'll still log on and check my mail. I have no issues putting in repairs.

[Fog]

To be fair, you don't need an Artisan specifically to repair stuff. You just need anyone who has chosen to specialize and invest in the openly-available crafting abilities required for the repairs or, as Preiman mentioned, if no PCs are available to do it, you can take it to an NPC to be repaired.

Lots of other helpful replies, because I'm new!

Is there a penalty for using NPCs to repair things? People have brought up permanently damaging a goods, and I know the lockpick NPCs take a bunch of the items out of the boxes, so this feels like a fair question to ask.

[Rias]

Is there a penalty for using NPCs to repair things? People have brought up permanently damaging a goods, and I know the lockpick NPCs take a bunch of the items out of the boxes, so this feels like a fair question to ask.

Any repair has a chance to permanently damage the item being repaired. Artisans with the right abilities have a lesser chance to do so, I believe, but the chance is still there. The bigger concern with NPC repairs is that they hold onto the item for about 24 hours and you have to pick it up later, so you'll need to use a replacement in the meantime. I know a lot of people who keep swaps around for this purpose. For example, I might prefer to use my riversteel rapier, but when it's in for repairs I would use my backup bronze rapier.

[preiman]

it's why i often have at least 2 of a peace of armor or weapon where it's reasonable, often more. Walk into Maric and althea's house sometime, we've made the local blacksmiths very happy over the last year or so.

[vidor]

I really fail to see the problem. Sure it would be great to repair all our own items, but lets face it. I could go get a sword from Ardor for maybe 2000 riln (don't have his prices in front of me). Then, if I can repair that, then I'm looking at 2,000 riln for my combat needs for the rest of forever. It's a nice to have, but by no means a necessity. The people who have equipment needing repairs almost absolutely have the riln to get it done -- riln which will go to artisans (both established and new) who then have an opportunity to be part of clok's combat side, at least tangentially. I've seen people charge fifty to a hundred riln for repairs. If you don't have that much riln, go out and get it. It takes maybe twenty minutes. Much less time than pumping up blacksmithing skill.

I've only just begun socializing and really meeting new people, so please take what I have to say with a grain of salt.

So far, it hasn't been as easy as "finding an Artisan" to repair things. Maybe that's because I haven't met a lot of people on the game, or because I'm still new, but whenever one of my items has been destroyed through usage, I visit a pawn shop to buy something else that fits similarly in the slot. Based off of a discussion regarding some pricey weaponry yesterday, I know this isn't going to be practical forever, but if you don't play when other players are around that can repair or craft valuable items, it can kind of suck. There's also the learning curve and just general information that can be a lot to take in with a new game.

Something else to think over is that not everyone plays during prime time with other players, and then they have to be capable of helping you, and also have the desire to do so. There are a lot of steps that have been glossed over by simply saying "find an Artisan."

First of all, welcome to Clok!
Second, you are absolutely right. I'm probably basing the ease, for lack of better word, off the fact that I've been playing for a little while and know who to mail in order to get repairs.
I think it's been said, though. If you reach out on esp, or even by talking to a pc in a town, and ask who you can send an item to in order to get repairs, you'll almost definitely get a good answer. We're players too. We know how frustrating it is when you need something repaired and nobody else is online. We'll do what we can to help.
There is also the mechanic of giving it to the built in mechanic to fix it. It's not ideal, but that is, of course, to promote ic interaction and economic activity.
I would be rather willing to bet, however, that it would take less time to find an online artisan and/or mail your item to a recommended artisan, rather than to build up the requisite skill to fix it well yourself. It's kind of like wandering in to best buy to fix your own computer, or looking at youtube vids to fix a guitar. You could do it, but there's a high risk you're going to wreck it.