CLOK BBS

I've posted in Woodworking about the creation of Totems, and on this post I'd like to talk about the Druidic uses for Totems after they have been created, as well as the differences between a totem and a Totem.

A totem is essentially decoration that can potentially degrade at a fairly high rate (except perhaps in specific rooms such as just outside of player homes, and of course within homes themselves). A Totem is almost a living thing. It is connected to the Gaea, as well as to the respective Great Spirits associated with each base totem. As such, they decay at a much slower rate than a normal totem, and can only be created by someone capable of channeling Druidry. The quality of the creation is based partially on woodworking, and partially on druidry. They cannot be picked up, and have to be dragged.


Basic Totem Use

One of the most basic uses for a Totem is to 'mark' an area in regards to Commune. What this means is that Skjotur could drop a wolf totem in a room, and any time anyone Communes with that room, the Wolf Totem would be mentioned somewhere in the Commune message. However, not all Totems will function in all environments. They will only function in an environment that the animal it is modeled after typically resides. Bison, horse, and coyote would work in plains, bears in forests and mountains, stuff along that general thread.

The second most commune use is that of the Dwaedn Wyr. Dwaedn Wyr are able to honor totems in Dwaedn Vil in exchange for Recognition points. Any Dwaedn Wyr on the Friend list of the crafter of the Totem would be able to (for a larger amount of recognition points than in Dwaedn Vil) be able to honor a totem to gain the effects of Hallowed Burial. Each time a Dwaedn Wyr honors the Totem, it degrades, which means it will not last as long as a totem that is never Honored.

A third basic use of the Totem would be to act as a ward or scry. By this, I mean that when raw cast with three channels of druidry, a Totem could reveal the passerby's for the past 12 or so hours in the room. Certain totems (such as Eagle or Wolf) are better at spotting and remembering passerby's than other's (such as most Cattle or Equine based). Casting this has a cooldown, and degrades the Totem majorly with each cast.




Advanced Totem Abilities

These are things that I have not thought out 100% yet. I wanted to see a general reaction to the idea of Totems and their uses before investing much more thought into specific abilities. All of the more major, long lasting, or "long distance" abilities would have a hefty cooldown of probably an hour or so at least, as well as only being able to be cast on one Totem at a time. They are also mutually exclusive. You cannot have different spells up on the same Totem.



Sigil of Nature's Guardian
Just a general idea for a protective spell that, when cast in a room with a Totem in it, gives the area a heightened awareness of danger. Not only will the area call out in distress to Druids via Commune, but it will retaliate depending on a few conditions. if only a tree or two is felled, then the worst that will happen is that perhaps a single mob will attack the player in question. If the "warning" is ignored, then more mobs of higher skill are spawned. If the area is already facing deforestation, then the wildlife essentially go crazy, potentially tanglerooting and sending powerful animal mobs after the target. The use of this spell places a fairly heft degrade on the Totem, and every time the area calls out in distress it is degraded further. This would have a pretty long duration, but with a massive (several hour) cooldown, take perhaps 10 minutes uninterrupted to cast, and only one of these could be active by one player at a time. Pre reqs would include druidry and woodworking.


Watcher's Sigil
This is a a semi-permanent spell like Nature's Guardian. Casting it on a Totem allows you to, from a distance, look at the room in question. The cooldown would be roughly an hour or so, with a duration that last quite a while. Again, it should take a while to actually cast, perhaps ten minutes uninterrupted. The initial cast of the spell would degrade the Totem a good deal, and every time a Scry was used on it would also degrade it a fair bit. Pre reqs would also include druidry and woodworking.





The general premise behind this idea is to sort of reinforce the connectedness of the Gaea as well as the other Great Spirits, and allow for a bit of guild to guild interaction between the more "nature oriented" guilds out there. I'd love to hear comments and thoughts on the idea, especially regarding more advanced guild abilities that use the Totems.

Totem Carving

I think the idea of imbuing powerful magical, scrying, and protective type abilities into a piece of wood and allowing them to maintain it over a long period of time is a bit far fetched (As well as designing and implementing a whole set of abilities for chunks of wood).

Druidry should be interacting with nature, not enchanting dying wood that's been painted and carved after you've chopped down gaea's trees. I'm not expert on druidry by any means but totems or Totems, if you really want to draw an in game distinction via capitalizing, do not seem to fit with the concept of gaea.

A dead piece of wood has no consciousness and is not connected to the earth any more than my boots are. I don't see why it would be capable of feeding you intel.

There are animal totems in Dwaedn Vil which warriors may honor for blessings, so that is at least evidence that the Great Animal Spirits may have a connection with specially-prepared carvings. I can understand the skepticism behind the concept of the Gaea having a connection to dead, carved wood rather than perhaps a living plant, but I have little knowledge of druidry so it may be that such a thing is possible.

The Guardian totem is an interesting concept which I could see as an interesting addition to the game. I fear the Watcher's will not be well-received, as the GMs have stated many times that they are against forms of scrying.

Building on the concept of the connection Animal Spirits may have with totems, perhaps a way to preemptively prepare a totem that renders local wildlife neutral to the carver and those in his group, so long as they do not harm any of the wildlife. For instance, a druid could place something such as a Totem of Companionship in the Stone Canyon and be allowed passage along with any group members through the area unharmed by the mountain lions, bears, wolves, and boars for the totem's duration. If the druid causes harm to any of the wildlife, the Spirits would feel betrayed and the animals would become hostile once again. Such a betrayal should likely have more severe consequences as well, in the form of a lack of trust from the Spirits.

[quote=Acarin]I think the idea of imbuing powerful magical, scrying, and protective type abilities into a piece of wood and allowing them to maintain it over a long period of time is a bit far fetched (As well as designing and implementing a whole set of abilities for chunks of wood).[/quote]

Not that far fetched being the Dwaedn already have these in place.

[quote=Evelyn][quote=Acarin]I think the idea of imbuing powerful magical, scrying, and protective type abilities into a piece of wood and allowing them to maintain it over a long period of time is a bit far fetched (As well as designing and implementing a whole set of abilities for chunks of wood).[/quote]

Not that far fetched being the Dwaedn already have these in place.[/quote]

I could be wrong but I don't believe Dwaedn utilize druidry. Honoring great spirits, sure. Connecting with Gaea, probably not.

Dwaedn are druidic warriors Acarin.

Animal Spirits are druidic immortals, according to the Immortals page:

http://wiki.contrarium.net/index.php/Immortals

I don't think Dwaedn Wyr utilize a direct connection to the Gaea like Udemi do, so they don't use the DRUIDRY command or use commune or anything like that, but that doesn't mean they're not druidic. I just assume they're more in touch with the Animal Spirits and the animal side of druidry, instead of the Gaea and the plant side like Udemi. It's like some elemacers focus on fire, others on water, but they're both elemancers.

The wiki page also calls Dwaedn Wyr "a druidic warrior order" in the very first sentence:

http://wiki.contrarium.net/index.php/Dwaedn_Wyr

Thank you for the constructive feedback Alexander, it's very much appreciated. To be honest, I wasn't totally happy with the way the Watcher's Sigil worked. It was just one of the few ideas I had for uses of the Totems. I like the idea of a Companionship one as well. I had a general idea of using the Enemy List as well as Friend List, but I was thinking that it'd be best to leave the Gaea as impartial and passive as possible unless protecting itself.

And thank you Slaidh and Evelyn for posting in regards to Druidry/Dwaedyn Wyr.



The Totem carving and ability set isn't about "enchanted wood" Acarin. It's more about a way to create a bridge between Druidic guilds and the like, and to promote interaction between them. The Gaea, the Wiki says, is Master of all Animals, as well as the soul of the living world. This implies there is a connection between the Great Spirits and the Gaea. If the GMs oppose the idea, then I'll leave it to rest. But there's already instances of druidry affecting dead wood, in the case of the Staff to Stave spell the Udemi get, as well as the fact that anyone that can channel druidry will be able to repair wooden weapons.



The other key to this is that this isn't limited to Udemi. There are people outside of the Udemi who can channel druidry, and thus the basic Totem making would affect them, as well as possibly giving them access to the same abilities as well as potentially unique abilities of their own. For instance, I'd love for Dwaedn to maybe have a guild ability that would let them possibly listen in on Commune, and to potentially make their own Totems perhaps with limitations to honoring them to prevent a Dwaedn Wyr from lugging around their own personal buff machine.

The idea of having something like this that connects all druids, even us lowly Dwaedn Wyr variety, I think is really cool. I'll try to think of some stuff to add.

A way for Dwaedyn Wyr to listen to communes would be really cool, if the GMs are okay with that. It would be more limited sice we'd need to be near a totem or something, and we could only listen, not send. After all if the forest is in danger that means the animals that live there are in danger too, and not from honorable challengers like Dwaedn Wyr!

The watcher totem or something like it could maybe connect with local animals to send an alert, like birds would fly out to druids and chirp or caw or shriek or whatever, then fly away. I'm not sure what would trigger the alert though. It would be good for guarding specific points in some situations I guess, or if you had a secret stash somewhere you'd be alerted if someone else was searching around that area.

Sorry, not the best ideas. I'll see if I can come up with some better stuff.

How about when you make a totem, you can't pick it up. So you have to actually make it in the place you want it to be effective. After all I'm assuming these things are pretty big and awkward to carry. So you would't be able to just make one in the middle of a danger situation, you would have to plan ahead and use them more strategically.

Well, I was thinking they wouldn't be able to be picked up at all, and instead if you want to move them, you have to literally drag them. In which case, it might be better to carve it out of a full tree instead of just a log. Perhaps when the final touches are put in (that turns it into a Totem, the third step requiring druidry), it can't be moved at all. Plus, I was thinking it would take quite a while to make them, as well as being a three step process, which each step taking perhaps a little longer than it takes to saw a single plank with carpentry (which takes a while).

I'll post a link to the Woodcarving idea regarding Totems in the original post.

I like the idea, but I am kinda confused with why THE Gaea would like someone cutting down a tree just to honor her/it.

Well they just don't like mass cutting down of trees, they cut down trees to make their bows and staffs. Also Woodworking is a Udemi thing.

AFAIK you can forage branches. That shouldn't upset Gaea. There are also plenty of trees that are cut and left to rot, I would think she would be pretty pleased that they're not going to waste on the forest floor.

Tse Gaiyan is more about balance and using nature in moderation, instead of being purely against the cutting down of trees at all.

The Gaea isn't, from what I gather, a peace loving hippy thing. But rather Nature itself. If a tall tree is cut down, it makes room for the smaller trees to grow, or plants beside trees, and destruction is just as much a part of nature as growth is. As long as it's done in moderation and smartly, I don't see why the Gaea would be opposed to it, as the Totems could be made to protect deforested areas while they regrow, and to allow Druids a more flexible network to communicate with each other.


As long as someone didn't just make literally as many Totems as they physically could, it should be okay with the Gaea and other Great Spirits. It could be hard coded in, in fact, that if a Druid cuts down too many trees in too short of a period, they lose druidry for a while, and perhaps permanently if they persist.

I think the Gaea's okay with using trees responsibly. If we're clear-cutting forests to make totems everywhere that's not going to fly. Tse Gaiyan uses wood for plenty of things though, like bows, arrows, other tools, building their guildhouse, stuff like that.

After all, we Dwaedn Wyr challenge and kill animals, then honor them and show respect. The key is knowing their spirit endures, honoring that, and being aware of the cycle and balance of life.

Totems would be great if after creation they could quickly be chopped into logs and sold at the marketplace.

Could you please try to stick to constructive criticism or suggestions instead of making sarcastic remarks? I appreciate input, as I'm sure everyone does, but if you just don't like the idea and have nothing constructive or helpful to add, I'd just as soon the thread be locked so that it doesn't turn into an unnecessary argument.

[quote=KianTheArcher]Could you please try to stick to constructive criticism or suggestions instead of making sarcastic remarks? I appreciate input, as I'm sure everyone does, but if you just don't like the idea and have nothing constructive or helpful to add, I'd just as soon the thread be locked so that it doesn't turn into an unnecessary argument.[/quote]

This is constructive criticism. I dislike the idea and have stated why. I'm sorry you don't like my opinion, but I'd love to see them be able to be chopped up for firewood or in some way eliminated if these are ever added and will be left about the wilds. I don't see why that is unreasonable or a sarcastic remark. If you leave wood lying about, I should be able to cut it up and make a profit.

Chop them up and destroying them is realistic but, they would make piss planks to sell from most of them having deep carvings into it.

[quote=Nootau]Chop them up and destroying them is realistic but, they would make piss planks to sell from most of them having deep carvings into it.[/quote]

Honestly, Planks would probably be reasonable. Considering the suggestion of using whole felled trees though, I think that converting them to logs would also make sense. It would depend on the size I suppose.

Seeing as logs are uncarved, cuts of a trunk, I don't think that would work. What would you use to carve down several sides of the totem by two to five inches(to remove all of the carvings). Are you talking about one (two if you are lucky) plank(s) from each of these totems rather than the four from a standard log?

[quote=Nootau]Seeing as logs are uncarved, cuts of a trunk, I don't think that would work. What would you use to carve down several sides of the totem by two to five inches(to remove all of the carvings). Are you talking about one (two if you are lucky) plank(s) from each of these totems rather than the four from a standard log?[/quote]

Sure. That would work. You'd probably be losing considerable amounts of wood in the creation process so that would make sense.

Chopping up animal totems could be possible, with the caveat that defacing or destroying a totem actively connected to the Great Animal Spirits would piss them off and bring all sorts of wild animals out to punish the offender.

Speaking of defacing, a nature hater could probably use a dagger to DESECRATE TOTEM, bring down an alert and calling a bunch of animals to the location.

And maybe a Dwaedyn could use an ALERT ability at a totem to send a distress call over the Gaea.

[quote=Slaidh]Chopping up animal totems could be possible, with the caveat that defacing or destroying a totem actively connected to the Great Animal Spirits would piss them off and bring all sorts of wild animals out to punish the offender.[/quote]

I could also see them losing any sort of connection the moment they are defaced and therefore not being able to maintain a link in order to summon animals. I would also doubt that Great Animal Spirits would sacrifice the life of the animals they are connected to over a carving/idol. It would seem to me that they would want to keep them safe instead of motivating them to combat and potential untimely death.